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American Looking to Fill 757 Gap; Eyes A330neo, A321LR

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Charles Schubert said on Thursday that the airline is actively looking to fill a gap soon to be left by aging Boeing 757s. The remarks came during the annual Phoenix International Aviation Symposium in Scottsdale, Arizona. (airwaysnews.com) 기타...

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lflinares
I'm a Boeing fan too but understand the business decisions. Boeing insists there won't be enough demand for a 757 "next generation" since it would fly thin transatlantic routes. One thing is for sure, one of the reasons airlines like American and Avianca went with large Airbus A320 family orders had to do with Boeing not being able do deliver 737s NG or MAC soon enough for their needs.
preacher1
As I said below, Boeing's concentration on the 787 took away resources from what they should have been doing, finding a suitable replacement for the 757. I guess the market was so saturated that there may not have been any demand but there is now, and whether they want them or not, the Airbus is there to fill the void.
preacher1
Americans needs and what UAL said about the 57 a few weeks ago ought to be enough to get Boeing off their duff and bring out a familiar version of the 757 for offer. They did it on the 737 when pushed. While they don't have an active production line as they did with the 737, they surely could do one and get something the air before the current batch goes to the scrap heap. That said, these airlines are going to have to get some skin in the game to Boeing and ink an order , LOI or something. Boeing has got to see something other than talk to various expo's and industry groups. This may be one where they have to step out on faith like they did the 737MAX
TorstenHoff
Even if Boeing had a design ready today, they don't have the production capacity, at least not without coming at the expense of other existing orders.

This may be one of those times where the smart thing to do is to let Airbus cater to what Boeing considers to be a niche market -- if they hadn't thought of it that way, they would have had a product ready.
s2v8377
s2v8377 2
I'm worried about Boeing on their future in the narrow-body market. The 737 is just loosing to many orders to the Airbus A320 family.

The 737-900ER and the future 737-9Max just aren't a suitable replacement for the 757. I also believe the niche markets that the 757 currently serve will grow. Airlines love narrow-body aircraft that have the range of a wide-body as they're much cheaper to operate.

I wish Boeing would bring back the 757 but I sadly just don't see it happening.
blueashflyer
I wait by my computer all the time, but I never get the emailed invite to the International Aviation Symposium. maybe next year
2018paulrobbinx
The sad thing is 20% of the 757 fleet is stored in the Mohave Desert crying for new owners before they are turned into soda cans. Why doesn't AAL revamp stored 757s like Delta?
ssmith3104
Thanks for mentioning the large 757 fleet stored in the desert. Airlines keep on forgetting this valuable and economic resource.
preacher1
Ain't the 757's in the desert on the high end of the age thing?
TWA55
TWA55 1
Delta is dumping the 757 as well
2018paulrobbinx
DAL is dumping the domestic 757s, but they have recently ordered 5 used , international 757.
s2v8377
s2v8377 1
American currently has 20 legacy AA internationally configured 757s as well 15 inherited US Airways 757s capable of the Trans Atlantic and deep South American routes. The legacy AA 757's date back to 2001 and 2002 and the US Airways 757s vary from 1994 to three inherited from ATA built in 2000.

At some point the two fleet will be combined giving the airline one fleet of 35 757s for these type of niche routes.

If I was AA I would just keep doing C Checks on the 757 as they easily have 10 to 15 years of life in them at a minimum.

The A321LR seems to be an interesting possibility, however to me personally the A330Neo would be a terrible fit as a 757 replacement.

Also with all of the 787s and A350s coming to replace the 767-323ER's, I don't know why they'd want to take on a larger less economical A330 fleet going forward.
s2v8377
s2v8377 1
Another point on what I wrote above. If AA wants to replace the 757's that badly why not keep C Checking the 767's instead of going with the A330Neo. The economics of planes either already paid for or on much cheaper leases probably is cheaper than going with new aircraft even with the difference in fuel burn. Plus 9 of their 767-323ER's a fairly new as they were delivered in 2003.

I'd personally keep either the 757 or 767 flying until Boeing's replacement for the 757 is on the market. Unless of course Airbus made me an offer I couldn't refuse on A321LR's.
lflinares
Exactly! I'm a huge fan of the 757, and would love to see an "NG", "neo", "MAX", whatever you want to call it, but there is no business case. Boeing will do with the "MOM" concept next decade, and it will be clean sheet.
preacher1
There are a lot of us that are 757 fans, both professional and enthusiasts. That said, we do not control the buying nor can we understand the thinking of those that do. The 757 is a pilot's airplane and from a looks standpoint, there is nothing out there that comes close. All that said, as PLANESOLUTIONS points out below, you cannot expect Boeing to maintain a full production line to cover a niche market. As to why AA would be going to Airbus, they are going to have to have capacity coverage. As far as why not just keep them C-checked and going on, they have done a lot of this with the mad dogs and when they are done, while all parts may be new, you still have an old aircraft. To boot, while not made public, Airbus is probably putting out some hellacious pricing as well.
s2v8377
s2v8377 1
AA's 20 internationally configured 757's really aren't that old being from 2001 and 2002. They haven't even been through that many C-Checks.

Delta seems to do a good job of keeping an old fleet going while remaining profitable!!! Even with their recent orders for A333's, B739ER's, and A321's the majority of their 757 and 767-332ER's which are all pretty old now, are still going to be around for several years as well as the MD88's and MD90's. Even their Ex NWA A320 are old now. Rumor has it Delta has five Ex. Shanghai Airlines 757 coming which will be converted into their 75S configuration. Delta has also created a new high density configuration for their 757's designated 75D/75H. The 75D are 757-232's (Ship 685) and the 75H's are Ex NWA 757-251's (Ships 5635, 5637, 5639, and 5648).

Like we've both said if Airbus makes American an offer they can't refuse they're going to go with A321LR.

However I still just don't see how AA or any other airline could make an A330Neo work as a 757 replacement.
PLANESOLUTIONS
The 757 does a remarkable job fulfilling some of the more demanding routes requiring seating capacity, ETOPS, and runway performance. The '75 has set the bar very high and that's why the airlines that fly these difficult routes have held on to them as long as they have. However, Boeing certainly can't justify developing an airliner just for this limited and specialized application, so in the end the airlines will just have to adjust and compromise with lesser equipment. This may result in flying routes at 75% capacity and raising ticket prices to offset the inefficiencies.
TWA55
TWA55 1
Delta is going to 737-900 max I thought to replace 757 fleet, so what does the A320 have over the 900?
757 is a good airplane I wonder if the 767 kind of took the wind out of the project those many years ago, much like the 787 may be doing today?
tehreedy
Sam Reed 1
With US Airways having some A330s (14?), the A330neo isn't the worst idea in the world...
2018paulrobbinx
Also, we have to remember that Boeing has the upper hand on Airbus in several sectors of the industry. Airbus may have a better replacement for the 757 (the world only needs 1000 of those), but Boeing has a wonderful 400 passenger twin-jet (777X) airliner that Qatar Airlines CEO said yesterday would make up many airlines international fleet's backbones while Airbus has sat on the bench with the A350-1000. Also, because Boeing has been focused more on widebodies the far more revolutionary 787 has outsold A350 by almost 300 aircraft (it's what they get for making a reverse engineered plane! LOL). And the 737MAX is a much more efficient plane than the A320NEO. Honestly I think the A321NEO(LR) and the 737MAX 8 compliment each other very well.
avihais
American airlines. Seems funny an airline named American has significantly more European Airbus aircraft fleet and more on the way.
Falconus
Falconus 3
I'm personally a Boeing person myself, but in this case, Airbus offers the product and Boeing doesn't. What do you expect American to do? Fly with 50% capacity just so that they can say "I bought American"? That's like saying that American Eagle should replace all of their Brazilian ERJ's with 737's.
TMcDonnell
Should mention, American Eagle is a misnomer as it is not a real thing, its the banner name for flights flow by Trans States, Skywest, Air Wisconsin and Envoy to name a few.
preacher1
Agreed. The 757 discontinuance was the biggest mistake Boeing ever mad as there was not a suitable replacement. By the same token, with no orders from the Airlines, what would you expect them to do. Problem is that they should have been using this last 10 years to figure out and launch something new instead of just concentrating on the 787 so much.
DavidIntl
As a frequent traveler, rather than a pilot or an industry insider, I have developed a strong preference for the Airbus aircraft. Give me an A380 over a 777 or 787 anyday (or God forbid an old 747). Flying 757's transatlantic is a miserable experience - good riddance. And why, in an international market, should American Airlines even consider where the plane is manufactured in its calculations. Most of us wouldn't consider buying most American cars just because they were made in the US. Why should an airline behave differently?
preacher1
Your comparison of the A380 to the types involved are not really a comparison as these are all not part of the equation nor discussion here. Had you been a flight aware member for more than 2o minutes, you would know this and have a little more understanding of the various comments and discussions.
DavidIntl
Many thanks for your warm welcome to the forum. I have used Flightaware for many years, but had not bothered replying previously. Now you see why.
preacher1
Your welcome is based own your own profile which shows you have only been a member about an hour. To come on unknown and with such a disparaging comment, and apparently uninformed, based on your short membership. Most new members at least take a bit to look around before jumping in with a know-it-all attitude.
DavidIntl
Know-it-all? In no way. Obviously, I am just expressing an opinion, a preference, and a view that airlines have no reason to consider the country of manufacture of the aircraft that they purchase. I clearly stated in my reply that I am not professionally connected to the aviation industry - except that I spend a lot of my life in the air. Lighten up.
2018paulrobbinx
I would not say people dislike Airbus because of the country their produced in, but instead because of their philosophy on a pilot's roll in a plane. Which effects the passengers in no way at all, like what preacher1 said.
preacher1
While they might not know it would be just that school of thought that might affect a pax. They have a control envelope that effectively locks the pilot out of the loop if they try and go outside of it. That little bit may be just what you need in an upset without having time to change laws. That said, there are a lot of them flying.
2018paulrobbinx
The system is not fool proof though, we have to remember Air France 447 and AirAsia 8501.
preacher1
I don't think the full verdict is in on AA8501 but on AF447 there were just too many bells and whistles they didn't know what to believe. Linked sidesticks would have help a bunch there too.
preacher1
Lightened. LOL. Tks for making yourself known. I guess it goes without saying that I am a Boeing man although that preference is derived from pointey end experience rather than a pax. as a 135/91 Captain, our 757 was quite a bit more comfortable than those found in 121 service. That said, while AA and other airlines are being forced to look at Airbus, they are making every effort to keep the 757 upgraded and flying. Got to be a reason for that.
btweston
btweston 1
Dayum, girl...
gloverrr1234
You read my mind. I also believe that AA should not be doing business with Airbus Industries. AA simply needs to step back, take a breath, and provide Boeing with all possible support. Goodness, AA just set an all time profit record last quarter. AA can afford to wait on Boeing.
AAaviator
Yes, they should buy American made, just like all of the rest of us U.S. citizens buy made in USA only.
RRKen
But, judging from what I have seen on the market since the 1970's, American Citizens do not by USA only.

Who ever builds what customers want, at a price they want to pay gets the orders. That's how things work today, like it or not.
joelwiley
(I think you may have missed the sarcasm font you AAviator's post)
KennyFlys
Ken Lane 0
Boeing screwed the pooch and it cost them. Pretty poor long-term planning for well over a decade!

Of course, the Darleen Druyun corruption didn't exactly endear Boeing to current and potential customers.

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